April 26, 2000. This is an interview with Mr. Wing Fong in Las Vegas, Nevada.

The following interview is with Mr. Wing Fong, General Partner in Wing Fong Enterprises, which specializes in Rental Property Management. He moved to Las Vegas in 1939. Mr. Fong has been a major supporter of the University of Nevada Las Vegas. He joined the Rotary Club of Las Vegas in 1968 and served as a club Director in 1972. He is a Paul Harris Fellow.

Interviewed By Lawrence J. Mullen, Ph.D.

Thanks for coming in and talking with me. The project I'm working on is called Communication and Community in Las Vegas. But also the Library is working on an oral history of Las Vegas, so I'm really trying to fulfill two roles here. I guess just to get started if you could, just for the record, state your name, and how long you've lived here and what you do today.

I'm Wing Fong. I've been in Las Vegas since 1939 which keeps me a little bit over 61 years in Las Vegas. When I came directly from China to Las Vegas, the whole county's population was 5,000 people. Of course most of them never dreamed Las Vegas would grow this big. So the University. At that time, it was called Nevada Southern. At that time, the community had no higher education in this area. There was only 3 different buildings: Frazier Hall, the library, and Grant Hall. And later on Dr. Donald Moyer tried to get the community people involved. There was a group of civic leaders who tried to put the deal together with the performing arts center to bring the community people out here. I think they tried for over a year and a half or almost two years. It [was] very difficult to achieve, so Dr. Moyer read about me in a newspaper, how I got a lot of things put together quickly. So he got me involved, and I called a group of community people to help to put the project together.

Would that be the school planning council?

That mainly was for the performing arts center.

I see.

And my wife Lilly and I got together, first of all, the community leaders who appointed me as chairman for fundraising. We did that with my wife's help, and also with a group of community leaders. We finally successfully secured enough money for the performing arts center, which is the Judy Bailey Theater and Art Ham Center. After that, Dr. Moyer went further, asked me if I would... with the architect, with Jim McDaniel, to put together a master plan for the campus. So we did both of them, and very fortunately, we got a lot of people in the community, even the people from the north, to help us to make this dream come true.

What did you think of Mr. McDaniel and the design of the UNLV campus and the performing arts?

At that time, Mr. McDaniel won many architecture awards, not only here, but in other places, in Las Vegas. He was very famous for revolutionizing the architecture industry, making it more modern and streamlined, and he won many awards. And he was really a devoted architect. For example, Art Ham Hall and the Judy Bailey Theater, it was his idea to divide [the theaters] into two parts because the acoustics [for] music and drama are completely different. So he and I went to look at different areas, what made them successful and why the other projects failed. We went to Lincoln Hall and also the (Dottie Shindler) Theater. We learned about the acoustics. It's so important. And the second phase, to decide how big we should build the building. At that time we knew, including Dr. Moyer, we knew the town would grow. The campus is going to grow to 25,000 in student enrollment. Dottie Shindler (???) Theater and Lincoln are (aren't?) much bigger than this one. At that time we knew we would always have competition on the Strip, you know, all kinds of entertainment. So we originally decided it's going to have a capacity of 5000. We figured people [would] feel much more easier [being able] to see the stage, so we decided [on a] limit [of] 3,000 seating capacity instead of 5,000. I said okay, if we [go] beyond 3,000, we'd like maybe two performances instead of one. Or three, if necessary. So we decided on 3,000 seats, which is working out real well. I don't think we [have] ever had overcapacity, or had to have a second performance.

Then the Judy Bailey Theater, we felt that every seat [should be] orchestra seat. You notice, again we designed it with about a capacity of 600. When we have, like [the] Nutcracker Suite, it takes [up] much space. Then they have 2 or 3 or 5 performances. Everybody enjoys both theaters, not only [from] the acoustic standpoint, but they feel like the place is almost full most of the time, so it gives them a good impression. The performance must be very good [since] the theater is almost filled up.

Now was the center seen as bringing something new to Las Vegas?

Yes. After the Performance Center opened, a lot of people donated money, and also too, we have a lot of outstanding artists come to Las Vegas. That happened for practically every performance. That's how we got people involved.

Was it difficult to raise money for the performing arts in Las Vegas?

It was difficult at the beginning because there was no organization. So [during] my first meeting with the group of outstanding community people, I said I think what we need is an organization. First of all, I told them how I did other projects with different community people. I said we've got to get our organization set up. First of all, we've got to [know] which direction we [are] going to go? How we plan it, and then how [do] we execute it. So that's what we did. We met and then the group of community leaders said Wing Fong, are you going in the right direction and everything, and are you going to know how to put it together? Why don't we name you as the chairman? So I humbly accepted, and then I said, first of all, we've got to have follow-up. We had everybody [select] a name of who they [thought could] get a matching fund. I said at the next meeting, if you don't mind, my wife Lilly and I will [keep checking with] you every 10 days to see where you[have gone], who have you gotten, and if not, we'll follow up again. So that's how we did it, how we raised the money. She would be on the phone every day, after the tenth day [doing] the follow-up to different people. That's how we raised that money.

Who were some of the major contributors?

The major contributor was Art Ham, Sr. Artemis Ham. I got them to donate $100,000. In those days $100,000 is like today almost a million dollars. Of course I've known the Art Ham family ever since I've been in Las Vegas. Next thing I did was get Judy Bailey. He owned the Hacienda Hotel. And she was real, real respected in the community and a very charitable person. So when we got the two major [donors], the other followed.

Just shifting gears a little bit here...Tell me a little bit about the business climate here in Las Vegas and how it has changed.

At that time, you know, the town was still small. And most people, the old-timers, practically knew everybody. And I explained how important the University [was] in relation to the business community. If we want [business to go in the right direction], we have to have a university here. A university will train people to help your business further. Also, most of you have children, grandchildren. What happens if they grow up, go out of town to attend University? More than likely they [will] end up with a girlfriend, and then get married, and they stay outside Las Vegas and you lose contact with your own family. So those were the two selling points I [used]. So that's how we got the money.

I was wondering if you could identify some specific times or events that were significant in the economic history of Las Vegas.

Economically, first of all, what helped the town start growing is the test site. Particularly in that period, a tremendous [number] of professional people came into town to do a lot [of] research. Especially E.G.&G. Herb Grier. I had a lot of contact with

What's his name?

Herb Grier. That's what E.G.&G -- one of the Gs stands for Grier. Now he [has] moved to Newport Beach and I have lots of contact [with him]. The next thing to do was [to build] a hotel college. Our hotel college is well known throughout the world. People from all over the world came here to attend this hotel college. That was when we were planning to have a separate building. Later on, Tom Beam, who [has been] a friend of ours for many years, and his neighbor, the coach Bill Ireland (?) tried to convince him to donate some money to the University. Unfortunately at that time the University had some problems, so finally the University contacted me. I contacted Tom Beam. I said, "Tom, I'd like to have lunch with you today." He said, "Sure, Wing, I'd be happy to have lunch with you". So we sat down to have lunch, and I explained to him why it's so important [that] we help the University grow. "Tom, you have made a lot of money in this community. And I understand you're working with your neighbors and the University'd like your help." He said, "You know, I have a lot of problems." I say, "Tom, tell me what the problem is." So he said, "the problem is, if I donate the money, I'd like some kind of input myself." I said, "Okay, any other problems?" He said, "That's about what this amounts to." So I said, "Let me go talk to the University people." I talked with the University people. I said, "You know, you [can't] blame the man. He's going to give a lot of money. It's [up to] you to find out what he wants." They said, "That's wonderful." So I went back to a second lunch. I said, "There's no problem, Tom, but you've got to tell me: what are the problems? And let me go back there and see if we can get this thing resolved. The University needs you, and you need the University." So he came back and told me what it's all about, and I conveyed the message to the University. And the University said, "No problem. Sorry, we didn't know that's what he had in mind." So that's how we raised the money for the Beam Business College and Hotel College together. That was the first venture, but before doing that, there was something else he wanted. I said, "Why don't we have dinner together?" So we had dinner together. He said, "Before I finally decide, I'd like to get my attorney, my accountant, and my family involved with you. We can trust you, Wing." So we had a nice dinner together, with the lawyer. I said, "Are there any problems with the estate tax?" He said, "No." The CPA said, "No. I think that's wonderful. Tom, you can do a lot of this [as a tax] write-off." So that's how we got the Beam Hall.

The next thing we did was [the] second project, the Engineering School. Because he's an engineer. So again, I said, "Tom, it's nice of you to name the building to remember your parents. Now how about you? You're really an outstanding engineer, you have [many years of] service. I'd surely like to have you give some money, and we'd name the building for you." He said, "Oh, you don't need to..." I said, "Come on, now." So we had a couple more meetings. That's how we got the money for the Tom Beam Engineering School.

I see. It sounds like the University, for you, is a real focal point. It's almost the heart of the community for you.

Yeah, that's true. Since then, I've spent about 60% of my time to help the University. Even to help them in planning the thing. Unfortunately, McDaniel passed away when he was very young.

Can I just ask, what do you think of the Henderson State College?

I think, honestly, I think its too early. What I'd really like to see is the University become well-established before thinking about the second state university. Our planning was that this would be the main campus, that the Community College would train for two years, relieve the main campus enrollment for the first two years. Then later on, when the University built up we'd think about that. And we didn't even think about it at that time. Even now I still think it's a mistake. It's too early.

Getting back to the more general business climate here, reading over your stuff, I know that you don't gamble, but obviously you've had good relationships with people in gaming, like Jackie Gaughan.

Yeah, Jackie Gaughan, he was a prime mover on one particular project. The Performing Arts Center.

I see. Was gaming simply another business, and these guys simply businessmen, or was there a different culture associated with the gaming industry?

We needed the university. We needed the involvement of them. So friends like Jackie Gaughan -- Jackie Gaughan is a Creighton University graduate. He's pretty much for education, so that's why he got involved, donated money. Let me see, Perry Thomas. Perry Thomas knows a lot of people we got involved. We knew that we needed the University and that we had to work together. Even now, the people [are] still behind [it]. Like Bill Boyd. He was one of my associates in the banking business, and he donated the money. We explained to him how important. So they are aware that it's not, ‘we're going to separate gaming and business.' They are really working together.

What do you think of the current business climate and the community?

It's getting a little bit big.Unfortunately, most of us didn't have the foresight. Most of big developers are from California. And it's getting to the point, it's so big [that] nobody knows who's involved in a corporation, and you don't see them anymore. So again, [we've moved] away from a cohesive group in the community..

Do you think that Las Vegas is still dominated by a few important business interests? Was it ever?

Maybe a little bit, but still, a lot of people [know] the old-timers. But 85% [is controlled by] outside developers, heads of corporations you can hardly see them or meet, so [its] getting a little bit more distant from the community.

I see. So it sounds like doing business is a little more difficult.

Yes. You don't know who to contact [if] you want to raise more money for the University. Fortunately we have some good [people] in Las Vegas like Tom Beam, and like Claude Williams, they're here, they [were] born here, and like Bill Boyd. So those people, like Christine Hickson, she's in charge at the Lied Foundation and we know each other, we can always [get in] contact. But the big corporations, it's really hard to contact [them].

I see. Tell me a little bit about Frontier Savings and Loan and Nevada State Bank.

Okay.

How did you form the original partnerships and raise the capital?

Okay. First of all, again, [by] knowing the people. The Frontier Savings and Loan, at the time the town was really growing. We needed a financial institution here to help. So I got together with, again, the old-timers. Like Harley Harmon, [Jim] Cashman Jr., to organize the Frontier Savings and Loan, which helped a great deal in expanding the community, particularly in the residential area. After we got the Savings and Loan set up, I said, the next thing we need is interim financing, you know, the contracting. The lender helps somebody take out a loan, the permanent financing. The second thing we thought of was to have a bank, and a bank does the interim loan, and then the savings and loan [could]do the construction loan. That's how it came about.

I see. Is banking different today than it used to be?

Yes. Because again, too many mergers. In order to be able to compete, say for instance, Bank of America and Wells Fargo. Wells Fargo took over [the] FIB Building. And then Bank of America took over [the] Bailey Bank. Other banks, like First Security, and our own bank, Nevada State Bank, [had] mergers, we had to take over a lot of small banks. So it [was] good to be able to get more financing to help [with] community development. That's what made Las Vegas grow much faster than we thought.

I see. Did the savings and loan crisis affect...

At that time, it was crisis because they didn't have very much regulation. People borrowed 125% instead of 75%. So that's [what caused] the problem. People would say, we only have a million, and the appraiser [would] inflate the price a little bit. So he'd say the project's really worth about $75,000 and they'd say it's about $150,000, so over [a] long [period], it made the economy slow down. The savings and loan got caught. That's what happened to savings and loan. Later on, the government made more regulations. Also, at that time, there [were] insider [problems] We all have a friend and so forth, so they [would] inflate the loan. Now they can't do that. An insider cannot really guarantee a loan anymore.

I see. Another venture of yours was Imperial Plaza.

Yeah.

I'm wondering, what was your vision of that?

Okay. I [was] very fortunate...That's way, way back. Charleston Boulevard. We built Bill Fong Garden out there. Everybody said, well, Wing Fong, you built your restaurant in the boondocks. That's way [out]. Two lane highway goes all the way there. At that time, I said "You know, as long as we have enough parking, people [can] get in their car and drive there. So that was very successful. The second venture was [on] Sahara Avenue. At that time, I built Bertha. And people said, "well, gee, that's pretty far away from everybody, you know." And now the very last one, right here, back in the corner of Maryland Parkway and Flamingo. And when we opened that one up, it was a real big building at that time, 65,000 square feet. And it was packed. Then Mr. Molasky saw what happened to that, and opened the Mission Center. And the third [structure] that I built was the convalescent hospital. At that time there were three companies that opened up, [and] it was overbuilt, and I was lucky at that time [that] I made the concept a little bit different. I built it like a square. The people could go inside the building, also they could go outside to a courtyard so they didn't feel like they were confined in a room all the time. And then we put [a] library and [some] entertainment in there. Ours filled up. The Imperial Plaza was the next project after that. I built that. I saw that the town was going to grow that way.

Tell me a little bit about the Asian Community in Las Vegas.

The Asian community was pretty small then and again, the Asian community was not very cohesive until lately. Some younger people came in. They have an Asian Chamber now, and also there's the Chinatown here, which helps a great deal. More than anything else is the number of Asian doctors that [have come] in, especially Chinese doctors. {They have] kept getting more and more recognition. Now the [Asian] community is pretty well respected.

So was it just more and more Asian people coming in --

Yes.

How were they meeting?

It [was] very difficult. I think that right now they mostly meet in different groups, in different areas. They formed an Asian Chamber, and they meet in different restaurants, different times. They have banquets, just like anybody else.

Did you belong to any Asian civic or business organizations?

No, I'm getting to the point it's pretty old, and hard to get involved. My son does. He gets involved with every one in the Asian community. I feel that I [should] try to concentrate my energy on the community and the University. My wife and I, we're still highly involved in the church. We're trying to build more churches.

How about the Chamber of Commerce and the Rotary Club, why did you join and what did you expect to gain by joining?

When I join anything, I don't expect to gain, I like to see results. More than anything else [that's] my aim. [In] the Chamber of Commerce, I was on the Board of Directors for three consecutive terms, broke the record. At that time, we needed people come in and plan for the community. You know, the community doesn't become this way by dreaming. At that time we knew we needed community centers. We needed the Chamber of Commerce to reach out beyond just Las Vegas. The Rotary Club is international. It reaches not only a large part of [the] United States, but [ is active] throughout the world. They do a lot of good things for people, and bring people together. We have exchange students come to the United States. I think that's the best [way] to build goodwill. [Students] stay with a family that resides in the area, so [that when they] go home, they can say, what wonderful people [live] in the United States. I think that's the best promotion for the United States. Also in different countries, we have [the] Polio Plus program. [We have immunized almost 98% of the children of the world. Rotarians have donated almost $600 million to the project since 1986.]

Great. Did you, as a Chinese businessman, feel welcome in these organizations?

At the beginning, almost 50 years ago, there was segregation. My wife was the first Asian teacher to apply for the job. At that time, the school superintendent, [was]very hesitant. Fortunately, we knew a lot of people. The president of the School Board knew us for many years, so he said, "how are things?" So I said, "Well, my wife has a bit of a problem. We don't know [how to solve it]." So he said, "No problem. I'll see to it. And your wife has good credentials, you're a graduate from USC, and [she] got a Master's degree [from UNLV], and let me talk to the school Superintendent." So later on the school Superintendent wrote my wife a letter that said welcome to the school district. The first sentence was, "Dr. Smith, either the Chairman or President of the Board, instructed me to hire you." That was really a shock.

Anyhow, they hired my wife and we knew that we [would] have to work much harder than the rest of the teachers. She was the first schoolteacher able to [build] a float, a 25-foot float. At that time, the test site, because of the test site deal, there was a national televised parade. Since then the school trustees really enjoy having my wife. At that time we didn't have any children. She took her work home. She'd come in and say, "So and so's daughter is crying in school, and I asked her why. It's because her parents didn't come to see her play." So my wife picked up the phone next day, [and said she] would like to get together with them. The parents said, "you know, we give her a bike, we give her this and that and that." And my wife said, "No, it takes more than just money. To show you are really supporting her, you have to go to her play, to give her moral support." Ever since then, she's become the best of friends with the parents. That's why I said, [in] all my projects and hers, [there's] a personal reward because we see the result. You can help other people. Like here, I'm really proud to see the building [built] there The people enjoy it, so we enjoy it.

It sounds like you've made all sorts of contacts in the community.

Yes.

How do you make your business contacts or your social contacts? Is it dinner parties with friends, or do you have people over? Do you go out socially? How do you meet people?

Okay. I'm glad you asked that question. We do know a lot of people. You know, when we were raising funds for the performing arts, we opened our home. [We'd] invite people [to] come over, and we furnished the food, the Mesquite Club furnished the drink. [One] day, we had almost 650 people in our back yard. The Mesquite Club finally raised $10,000 in that one event. And also, too, we attend churches, different functions. But mainly, [in the] early years, everybody practically [knew] everybody.

Do you go out a lot? Do you go out to the strip, to the hotels?

To sleep in a hotel, fortunately, we do not. But we [participate in] a lot of organizations. For instance, I'm still on the advisory committee for Opportunity Village. Last week, we raised, the Rotary Club of Las Vegas, raised a lot of money for Opportunity Village. Just different functions, like the church we raised the money for. Before we raised the money, we approached people, the first thing they asked was: "How much money do you donate?" So that's before they opened their wallets. That's part of how we contact most people.

I have to ask you this, this may be kind of on a tangent. But you've been in the restaurant business. I was just wondering if you have a favorite restaurant in town that you...

Not particularly, we don't eat out that often, but there's Joyful House for Chinese food. We don't go out and eat that much, but I feel like -- I'm not a cook or anything -- but I watched my uncles cook, how they prepare food. You know, in the banking business and the real estate development business, it requires a lot of mental work. So I like to go home and get a few things and put it together, and that's kind relaxing. We cook our own food at home.

Going back to the 1970s, you were working with Mayor Gragson --

Yeah.

-- as a liaison with minorities, the union and the chamber in the city.

Right.

Which minorities were you working with?

I was working with the black people. And as a matter of fact, we formed an organization called Community Solution, to help the community. How that came about was that the Chamber of Commerce and the labor [unions] clashed. And it was very difficult to bring the two [parties] together. At that time, Mayor Gragson came and he said, "You know what? There's one person who can bring these two groups together. It's Wing Fong." He asked me, so I called a couple people, community leaders with the West Side, with the black community, and the union together, and the Chamber together. The three of them met together. So we told them it's not for the [benefit of] the Chamber of Commerce, or the labor [union], or the minorities. What we need is to work as a cohesive group to solve the solution. So we worked, I think about a year and a half, [and] we got things solved. Things calmed down, and the unions got what they wanted. And the Chamber, one of their aims was to get together and become a peaceful community. That's how we did it.

I see. What was the relationship like between the Asian community and the African-American community?

At that time, really, nothing.

Nothing.

Because it's a small group. The people, I'm very fortunate to know a lot of people, like Dr. Barbier (?), he [was] a college professor here. So that's how I met him. And then a couple doctors out there. I'm [was] also in the school planning. And that helps a lot of problems between the schoolteachers and the minority groups. I said I'm not going to worry about offending anybody, if I see something that's wrong, I like to speak up. So I think Dr. Meldon one time said, that was in the school planning. "What's the use [of] going to college? They're going to end up a shoeshine boy or a janitor." So my first question was, "Dr. Meldon, are you a shoeshine boy, or are you the janitor. Tell me who are you?" He said, "Well, I'm a doctor." I said, "You see, I tell you to go to some of the Chinese. We point out the best -- doctor, lawyer, educator. Look, they're Chinese. If they can do it, you can do it. But you're a good example to tell them to ask [about] how they [can] become a lawyer. How you [can] become a doctor. Get a group together, and get the class together, and talk to them. Furthermore," I said, "I can help you. If you want a banker, I'll get you a banker. So encourage them and tell them how you and how they became professional people. That's the philosophy." So after the meeting, he came over, he shook hands, and said, "Mr. Fong, I'm glad you caught my attention. So how are we going to do it?" I said, "Okay, let's do it. Set the time to start." I always believe in action; that's how we resolved the school problem of segregation. I helped the Clark County Schools. That's why they named a school for both Lilly and I.

Governor Laxalt saw what we did for the community here, so he appointed me [to the] Equal Rights Commission. He wanted me to become the Chairman, I said, "Paul, I have too much involvement in here, but I'd be happy to become a member, to [do] anything that I can help."

Besides working with the mayor and on the state Equal Rights Commission, did you have any other political ambitions?

Well, the community wanted me to run for City Commissioner or something at a higher level. I said, "I feel I can do a lot more behind the door than do all that parading around. So people respect me, I have something. I'd say, "Let's have a lunch and talk about it." [This is] what I'd like to have you to do. So that way, people always respect me and tell the newspaper, and go on TV. So that's one of the secrets, [of how] I get a lot of things done.

It says here you have been planning a model city on the west side. And I was just wondering what you envisioned and why it didn't work.

We did start it, a sewing factory. Here's the reason: they said, you know, there are a lot of children, can't go out to work. I went to Los Angeles, [where] there were a lot of Chinese people doing the work at home. And then they'd have somebody from the factory come by, deliver the merchandise there, unfinished merchandise, and then pick up the finished merchandise. So the wife didn't have to leave the house at all. She'd be able to watch the children. So I thought that was a pretty good idea [and] I met with a few leaders. As a matter of fact, I have several sewing machines, some from Montgomery Ward, some from Sears, and so forth. But to get the people together was very difficult, so it didn't materialize. Fortunately, the senior citizens over there utilized those sewing machines and for a long time they wrote me every year around Thanksgiving to thank me for getting them those machines. And they make some things and they sell them and make money. They've been able to take a couple of trips every year deriving from the things that they made and sold. At least [that] compensated a little bit.

But together, it [was] very difficult for them to understand. Say for instance, like the time they wanted the cocktail waitresses on the strip. And [to] get some colored dealers. We had a hard time. They were hesitant. Finally, I said, "Look, first of all, give me a live one." They said, "What do you mean, live one? They're alive." I said, [to be] a cocktail waitress, they have to be 18 years old, or 25 years, I can't remember. And they have to go through the sheriff's department. So finally, they sent somebody there. They checked her out. She was only 18 years or something, not quite meeting the age requirement. So finally, I kept after them and they started breaking the barrier between management and the Culinary Union and they began to hire.

Well we've been at this for about an hour, I don't want to keep you too much longer.

Not at all. I'm happy to talk to you, like anybody else.

Well, great. As a communications professor, I'm interested in how you get your information about Las Vegas or the events that are happening. Do you read the local newspapers, or do you watch local news, or...How do you learn about Las Vegas, personally?

Fortunately, we have a lot of friends, besides reading the newspaper and watching the TV, For instance, Hank Greenspun. Hank and I were real good friends. I belong to an organization called NCCJ. National Conference of Christians and Jews organization. I was really, really active in that. Again, respect by earning. We have NCCJ meeting annually. Maybe they had, maybe 150 people at most attend. When I became the Chairman, I really gave 100%, picked up the phone, called everybody up, everybody said, "Oh, oh, we'll come." Of course, Hank is not there anymore. And like Harry Levy, Levy's gone. We had three years, and we had 600 people attend. We got, at that time, Governor O'Callaghan, and Senator Bible, and I can't remember the Congressman. We had the top officials from the state of Nevada. They all came, and they have respect. And that's how we did it, by knowing the people and contacting [them.] We were younger, we attended practically every event in the community. So actions speak louder than words, so they [would] see us there, and we told them what we think. That's how we do it.

So it's really kind of interpersonal communication?

To me, it's still personal contact. I've [had] a long, long talk with Brian Greenspun. We were talking about old times and and so forth. We're still in pretty close contact, even if second generation. Perry Thomas -- Perry Thomas' son, Tom Thomas, we're still talking to each other. He's the president of Rotary Club [of Las Vegas] this year. And his father always says, "Say hello to Wing Fong."And we talk. So I think the real personal contact and follow-up is really important.

I'm going to ask you a really general question, and you can just give me your opinion on what do you think a community is?

I think a community has one aim [and that is] to see that it [is] going the right direction, [to] keep it growing, and we think that we should diversify, which we are working very [hard] on., Dr. Moyer and I [at] that time, over 20 some years ago, [favored] high-tech. At that time, we knew in order to do that you've got to have a good university. Like Silicon Valley over there [where] you have Stanford, you have California University at Berkeley, and that's what we need here. At that time we almost got Texas Instruments to come to Las Vegas. But they looked at [Las Vegas and said] we don't have that here. So we learned a lesson. That's why I try to sell how important the University is for us to grow [as a community]. You just can't depend on a single industry: tourists. So what we did was try to get diversified, and we have the warehousing industry coming in here and are hoping there will be something else.

What do you think will be the next logical industry?

I think the most logical one is still high tech. I just got back from a trip to Edwards Air [Force]Base. We saw a plane that can stay in the air for 32 hours. A man was able to take pictures [from] 65,000 feet high, and pinpoint[the number of trees in the picture.]. Today's a high tech field. I saw the Geology department here, [where] a lot of the research [is] going [on]; that's how important the University is.

What do you think are some of the major problems that Las Vegas faces currently?

The major problem is, right now, the water. I know we [can] get enough water for another 7 or 8 years. [Another] major problem is air pollution, the traffic pollution, and also crime problems. You know, every city when it's growing this fast runs into problems, but I think these problems can be overcome.

So you think we have the know-how here to solve our problems?

We are working at it. I think [that for] every problem there's a solution. If you work hard enough, it can be done.

Do you think things are growing too fast here, that things are growing, that the place is getting too big?

Yes, I think we're going too fast, trying to catch up. And it's very difficult. Of course, you couldn't blame them For most of the corporations, particularly the developers, this is not too big a concern. Their biggest concern is getting there and getting things set up, instead of looking at the future and the present, [and] what is the effect on this community.

Do you think Las Vegas has a sense of community?

I still think we do. We do.

So you think it was stronger in an earlier year?

In earlier years because it was smaller, and it was much easier to make contacts than [it is] today. You know, some of the old-timers passed away, and the newcomers came in. They don't know the problems that we have and how we have overcome those problems. It appears to me that they are [from] out of state, the first [feeling] is [that] they've got to get in there and make the money. Keep the corporation going, or satisfy [the bosses.].

So the sense of community is what today? Is it...

Not like before.

Yeah.

There's a lot of newcomers coming in, [and] they don't know. And even the local people, most of them passed away and you have the second generation. And some of the second generation. Some leave after they get married, go out of state. And you have traffic problems, pollution problems, so they begin to look [for] some other place [to live.].

I see. Okay, finally, what are your predictions for Las Vegas?

I think Las Vegas still is going to grow. Maybe not as much as they predict, say two million, but I'm pretty sure it's going to grow to a million and a quarter. Of course in time, it'll grow probably to two million. Because they'll see what they're offered here: we have a good climate, entertainment 24 hours a day; you can take a friend to have dinner out, 24 hours a day. And more than anything else, you have the lake less than 30 minutes [away] for recreation. Lee Canyon, you can ski out there, and [Las Vegas is] just the number one destination in the world. You can see Paris here, Venice. You know, you've got everything, [the reputation as] destination number one is still going to be maintained. I don't think anybody in the United States can [build] that kind of tourist industry-- to have people come from all over the world.

A lot of people say when we first start traveling, [they are asked] "Where are you from?" "USA." It doesn't ring a bell. And then the tourist guide says, "You know, say Las Vegas, see how they react." Say Las Vegas: "Ahh, Las Vegas! We saw it on television. We've been there!" Or, "We're going to be there." So you know, with the transportation easier now, I think you will see a lot of people from all over the world come to Las Vegas. That's our main industry. But I'd still like to see it diversify

So you think that we've truly become an international city?

Yeah.

And yet we need to diversify to really progress more steadily business-wise and economically.

Yeah.

Well thank you for your time, Mr. Fong.

It's my pleasure.

It was a real pleasure meeting you and talking with you. Thank you.

If you have questions later on, please give me a call.

Okay, great.

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